I'd like to see Kaito involved in BO again- Heiji isn't okay being involved but Kaito is okay huh?

OMG YES I WANT IT TOO

22:52 Jii!!!! Kaitou Kid's accomplice!!! I love how they put detailssssss

Lol

Damn! Detective Conan has never been stressful to me until now.

What do you mean stressful ?

I'm sorry. I should have put intense or a more tactful term. But what I mean is, it's super intense that I get super nervous and it's stressful for me.

Oh okay then

Damn my chest hurts when I'm excited

I get goosebumps every time i watch this part... panic

THIS EPISODE WAS SOO EXCITING !!!

What!!! All I can say is what a fantastic arc, Conan calling in all the troops including Kid and his mum but not poor Heiji lol I was running through every possible person present who could've been disguised as Shiho and knew that Kid had been mentioned but I wasn't able to see a reason to get him involved, but I guess Conan was just that desperate to protect Haibara and he was owed a favour (｡●́‿●̀｡) plus my last comment was too soon, as it was actually Amurou posing as the Fake Akai up until now which makes a lot more sense. But the biggest jaw dropper was the simplest, literally just seeing Subaru open his eye for the first time revealing those pretty green Yu-Gi-Oh eyes of Akai killed me lol

Agreed this arc was great

So it's Bourbon who's disguising as Akai in that mall incident

and the bank robbery where Jodie-sensei and the kids got trapped inside.

I noticed in the op!!! They changed the WHO IS BURBON? to WHO IS BOURBON?. Spelling correction

Ah

and now i am back to square 1
lost and not knowing what's happening

Bourbon asked Vermot to disguise as shu to see what outsides are up to and Bourbon as a spy for the liok out staying in mouri's office as an assistant planning to savatage those who are in the way if that is what you are confused about

thx

To explain this entire case for future reference it goes something like this:

- BO wants to know if Akai Shuichi is actually dead. Their method was to disguise Bourbon and Vermouth at different times and basically see natural reactions of FBI and other people. Since Bourbon and Vermouth as both pretty good at reading people, they'd easily tell genuine and fake reactions.
- BO plans to kill Sherry on board the train (IF I remember correctly, IF, they know she’s getting on the train because the pictures got out of her saving the kids in adult form I believe). Vermouth knows that Haibara will turn into Sherry, and thus keeps the secret that she turned into a kid. For reference, Bourbon doesn't know about Haibara's identity, but it doesn't matter because he'd only see Sherry.
- Conan realizes this, so he develops the plan. The plan was to swap out Sherry with Kaito Kid, and to have Haibara safe elsewhere. He predicts that Vermouth would meet Yukiko (Shinichi's mom) and prevent her from being the fake Sherry. Thus, he has Yukiko pretend that they've been cornered, and predicting that Vermouth would be the one to seize the call, he responds with a fake of his own. He also uses Subaru, who is Akai Shuichi, to not only guide Haibara towards where she needs to go but also to mess with their plan a bit. Oh also, he takes Sera to a safe place as well.
- At this point, Haibara is in a safe location listening to Bourbon and Kaito Kid talk, and is able to give him stuff to say. Bourbon seemingly asks questions that only Sherry would know, so he is convinced it's her. Lastly, he blows up the carriage and Kaito Kid escapes.

A key factor would be the fact that Vermouth decided to take action into her own hands rather than let Gin and Vodka do the job. Gin believes they have killed Sherry since both Vermouth and Bourbon vouch for it.

Now, Bourbon wants to re-investigate Akai Shuichi's death from scratch because he believes that the person he saw on the train was none other than Akai Shuichi. And he'd be correct for assuming so. Subaru ofc opens his eye to reveal that he's Akai Shuichi.

This just goes to show how scary good Conan is at developing plans and predicing what the BO will do. He completely outsmarts Vermouth and Bourbon. I think mostly Vermouth though, since Bourbon doesn't know about Haibara being Sherry.

One thing to note though is that Bourbon does suspect Haibara has something up, but it's not confirmed whether or not he knows or thinks she's Sherry.

you messed it up a tiny bit. Bourbon/Amuro only used a small charge to detach the baggage car from the train. filled with explosives and carrying Sherry/Kaito Kid onboard, the car slows down to the middle of the bridge. Vermouth triggered the bomb she 'borrowed' from Vodka inside the luggage car.

also, Bourbon has been Scarred Akai this whole time. only on the train did Bourbon show up as Amuro since he's undercover with Team Conan. Scarred Akai on the train was Vermouth.

you also forgot to mention that Gin was going to blow the ENTIRE station platform up taking out THE WHOLE TRAIN and everybody there. Bourbon, Vermouth, and Sherry (if B/V captured S alive) were to be included in Gin's plan. luckily Vermouth saw through this one, but she didn't tell Bourbon what her trump card would be. the exploding luggage car would cause the train to HAVE to stop at the next station and not arrive where Gin and Vodka were waiting. Vermouth REFUSES to allow ShinRan to be killed by the BO.

i 'believe' Bourbon knows Haibara is Sherry because he saw the video from the cabin fire and has seen Haibara. i think! so as soon as Bourbon sees Haibara ever again he'll know somebody else blew up in that luggage car.

i am uncertain if Shinichi has figured out Subaru is Akai. somebody somewhere got in contact with Akai. probably Yuusaku through his American contacts. then in some way shape form or fashion Yukiko put Akai through 'disguise boot camp'. thus Subaru was created and imbedded himself in the Kudo mansion. now how Akai figured out a way to do this all the way back in the apartment complex arson... i've no clue.

I don’t think shinchi knows that Subaru Akai at this point because I never saw his reaction

I see. Didn't know it was only Bourbon I assumed that both of them were scarred akai given that Vermouth is the one particularly good at disguises and differing between acting and real.

Yea, Gin was gonna blow the entire thing I didn't mention that. Gin has that way of doing things after all. I'm not entirely sure if Gin would be willing to sacrifice both Vermouth and Bourbon though that seems like a really strange move. Is there any confirmation in the manga that that was the plan? To kill the two other operatives?
But I never said anything about the method that they "killed" sherry so idk how I could mess that up? I just said that Vermouth had her own plans that conflicted with Gin.

Yea I mean, knowing Amuro he should be able to catch on pretty fast. Still, he's not quick to jump to conclusions but given his stance on someone like Conan safe to say that Haibara isn't particularly safe from his eyes.

Wait wdym uncertain if Subaru is Akai? Shinichi/Conan came up with the plan to fake his death and keep him as Subaru so that the FBI operatives would think that Akai is death thus resulting in the BO thinking that he's dead. His mom helped with the disguise and the professor helped with the voice changer. Was that a uh... a slip? Did you mean Bourbon or someone else? I think that at the end it's likely but not clear is Amuro actually figured out that Subaru is Akai. However, given some other episodes, I'm gonna assume that Amuro is completely thrown off a bit (if you know what I mean).

But yea, some good points that you added. I excluded some of the plot because I wanted to be a little more concise the sequence of events. Good input though.

as to your 'what did i mean'... according to the anime, not the manga, i don't read sources.

i am unsure if Shin was/is aware Akai is alive. i think Yukiko and Yuusaku either helped Akai and Kir fake his death... or they got ahold of Akai somehow after he was able to get through his 'murder'. the whole Subaru thing... i'm still uncertain how those three arranged the entire apartment complex arson... or why... if it was just to insert Subaru/Akai into the Kudo mansion as a next-door neighbor/watchdog/support personnel for Prof. A and Haibara etc. i've no clue.

nothing in the Raven Train anime episodes shows that Shin knows Subaru is Akai. i'm pretty certain Conan included Subaru in the plan since Haibara had seemingly warmed up to Subaru in front of Shin.

Yuusaku and Yukiko would NOT easily let Shinichi and Akai cross paths obviously. those guys have worked together amazingly around unconscious Kir and using her as a mole with the BO. but Akai didn't know the whole story with Shin and Haibara at that time.

to keep from distracting Shinichi with the Subaru/Akai problem, his mom and dad just let him keep thinking Akai is dead. Shin only knows Subaru is a good guy with a big Sherlockian head on his shoulders.

also, Shin KNOWS Akai dated Haibara's big sister, and YuuYuu would DEFINITELY NOT want Akai and Haibara meeting up like that. that would make Shin have to deal with 'tell Haibara, not tell her' in a sticky situation like the Raven Train.

the 'special guest' Yukiko mentions to Vermouth is Kaito Kid... not Subaru/Akai. remember, Sonoko's Great Uncle has that big jewel on the train and bla bla bla... so to make sure Vermouth figured out that it was Kid... that's why Yukiko said 'special guest' that way. special guest, as in show-business, acting, stage magicians... hmm? do you see what Kukiko was leading Vermouth along with?

remember, Vermouth's doing her internal monologue on the train platform and Prof. Agasa and everybody else walk past her. this is before Bourbon/Amuro asks her for the BO files on Akai's death. Haibara-chibi-version is riding on Prof. A's back wearing a baseball cap and face-mask. Vermouth sees lil Haibara and instantly gets that somehow Shin coerced Kid to be 'big Haibara' bla bla bla. Vermouth was probably aware that her mentor Touichi Kuroba was the previous Phantom Thief bla bla bla.

never forget, Touichi Kuroba was the one who trained Vermouth and Yukiko. that's how the two ladies first met. this fact was shown in the anime. when a younger Yukiko is sitting across the table from Touichi, Kaito (younger back then) walks up to them and says hello. Touichi introduces his son to Yukiko. previous to this specific episode, i think it was the New York case, Yukiko mentions to Shinichi how she first met Sharon. but she didn't mention Mr. Kuroba's name or Kaito. just that she and Sharon/Vermouth had trained together under the same magician and disguise expert.

i'm certain Bourbon/Amuro asked Vermouth for the BO's files on Akai's murder BECAUSE he's uncertain 'Subaru's Eye Flash' was Akai's eyeball.

as the old saying goes, the devil is in the details. ;) but as we both know the anime does a crazy good job making some things fuzzy on purpose. because if they made everything crystal clear, future manga chapters' reveals wouldn't be 'as cool' when they made it into the anime.

presently i'm only on episode 715, but i will catch up soon. :D

I need to see that episode soon

OH SHOOT BTW ACTUAL SPOILER ALERT^^^

So from everything I’ve watched via the anime, it’s very apparent Conan knew because he’s the one that devised the plan in the first place.

In fact, this is directly stated in the anime. Vermouth confirms Akai’s death by stating that “he never planned to say that”, referring to when Akai said “to think you’d go this far”. This was not being said to Kir, but to Conan’s plans. Additionally, this is backed by the fact that when Subaru first shows up Conan isn’t scared of him at all and throughout seems very “familiar” so to say with him.

Additionally, I believe that Akai even says when the big reveal is that that the boy planned everything out and to fool one’s enemy you must first fool your Allies (at least, something similar)

So I’ll just clear that up and say that Conan is the one that set up the Akai Subaru trick, and he is the one that got all the actors together for everything. His parents, the professor, and Kaito Kid (for both the Subaru Akai trick and the train case).

I’ll also note that I definitely knew Kaito Kid was the surprise guest. Additionally, I’ve watched Kaito kid and read up on the whole story between the stuff, it’s honestly pretty interesting ngl. The story is all connected.

But sorry to say but I’m like 99% certain the anime straight up confirms that Shinichi made the whole plan and thus was the first person to know that Akai would become or be Subaru.

:) well i'll certainly say i'm uncertain! :> i'm not exactly on the fence about it, i hop back and forth from my side, your side, my side, your side, each time we discuss the: "Akai was Shin's plan all along VS Akai was Yukiko's plan all along". hahaha! :D

i just don't know sometimes, these screenwriters work up some great manga adaptations sometimes and then... they fall flat on their faces when it comes to writing a good number of the filler episodes.... annd then sometimes the manga adaptation is... a stinker. 'Heiji and the Vampire's Castle'? eps.712-15, manga case #241... ohh gawd that was a baaaaad one! :p truly stinky! :p

the only thing about the 'vampire castle' that truly surprised me was the rich dude writes up a huge list of instructions on how to murder some people, tries to send it to his illegitimate daughter to carry out, THEN CUTS HIS OWN HEAD OFF with the min-guillotine in his torture chamber? ack! that's gross! :o then the other guy runs around the house with the guy's severed head and instructions, using them to scare people! now THAT part surprised the crap outta me. the head part the rest of that storyline was kinda ... meh... i could see this, and that, and the other thing was coming...

but anyways, about the Raven Train... hmm... i just don't know! :D hahaha! :D you haven't exactly convinced me! but i'll certainly keep an open mind about 'Shin knew it all from Step 1' ...

Dw dw! An explanation will come soon methinks. Watched this a while ago so I can't remember what comes when but it'll all come together like a puzzle

i wonder, maybe it'll be around when Conan figures out and talks with mrs 'you know who' about her kids. ;) i haven't looked up the whole Akai Family Arc but i've so far assembled most of the pieces.

Thanks captain!

I mean you had the black originazation hunting down ,Conan eventually finding kaito kid asking him for a favor ,shinchi’s mother shows up and finds vermouth ,sera curious who was that mysterious person on the train .Those aren’t hard the only answer is amuro and his story having to deal with the black origanization so far

17:53 yukiko's acting great as always no wonder why she got the legendary actress title

Damn this episode had a lot to unpack it’s literally episode 345 where everyone has something to do especially kid kaito

It goes to show that when Conan thinks and plans before he acts he can pull of really amazing turn arounds, he's almost completely useless when he charges in without thinking though. shinXkid moments at the end are the best, I love it when those two get to work together. what I want to see most is shin helping kid out with the organisation kid faces instead of the BO

Yeah

Thrill, Shock, and Suspense

14:35 No how could you, this is the greatest betrayal i've felt in this series so far !!! but i'll keep pretending bourbon never said this and keep my suspension of disbelief (I mean akai cannot be dead after that tragic kir arc,,,right?)

Ooohhh will someone betray the organization??

Oh wait, what??? WAIT WHAT??? W H A T ??! that mini sequence is too much for me

WHO DIED THEN?? wat. ohmygod !!!

AHHAA i find it funny when Subaru's eyes open when he's portrayed to be sus or mysterious and then close again

this episode is so good :DDD

conan is the man like wow, you were able to see this

and ofc kaito is so great at impersonating people, he did not even know what kind of person sherry is

yukiko is so great at acting ><

subaru in the shadows ><

Yeah I know felt like episode 345 again but it sure took a while to get good

many revelations :D

lets go brothers, end this arc once and for all
#grabs popcorn

if they know the identity of vermouth, wouldnt that be fruitful ground to conduct some "offensive operations" against the badies?

Yep

These are my favourite episodes for sure

Good arc but definitely packed I still like episode 345

I admit I didn't see that coming, that certainly was a special guest.

Subaru had like 20 seconds screen time over 4 episodes and was still one of the best :D